RF Tennis News 2017

Yes Vinny to all that you said. I still find the 2008 Wimbledon final to be the most heartbreaking for me. Followed by 2009 USO and then 2009 AO. But then I really only started following Roger some time in 2007. I missed the real glory years unfortunately. But I agree that Roger played the tournament the way we love to see him play, by attacking. And the sped up courts helped. How many times did members of the forum bemoan the "happy slam" over the past few years (since Roger's last win in 2010) when the courts were slow as molasses? Let's hope Wimbledon and the USO follow suit this year. It would be nice if the court surfaces became more varied, the way they were intended.

Well, avasbar, you certainly got me all hot and bothered I agree with vinny- the most spectacular aspect of the AO 2017 was the return of all court tennis. And anyone who puts that dreadful, vomit inducing spectacle that was AO 12 as a great match is not worthy of my attention.

Not a fan of Flink at all. When Roger was doing well in the summer of 2014, Flink dismissed Roger's wins as coming against sub-standard opposition or out of form players. He has also peddled the weak era garbage. Jon Wertheim used to get a lot of hate on the old website because of a couple of his comments against Roger over the years (The Wimbledon 2010 comment was excessively harsh) but in general, Wertheim is very complimentary of Roger and recognizes his genius. In all the years of watching Tennis channel and ESPN, I have never heard one educational insightful piece of information from Flink. So I honestly cannot put any stock in his assessment. Even if I agree with Flink that AO2017 wasn't the greatest match ever played even between these two, it is ridiculous to put the AO2012 ahead of this match. Quantity over Quality basically.

pheebe wrote:Well, avasbar, you certainly got me all hot and bothered

Ooh dear Pheebe!  I hope it wasn't really me who riled you and rather the author of this piece! .  Posting it was not an indication of agreement with his views - as I said above. I was curious as to other's opinions so I'm glad others are chipping in.

tvradke wrote:Even if I agree with Flink that AO2017 wasn't the greatest match ever played even between these two,

What is great? That is what I find interesting.  Matches are epic and great for different reasons but tension and high drama do come into it and how the players manage to raise their games to their absolute finest has to be a major element.    I'm not qualified to argue that Nadal did or didn't play his finest in this match, but he played the finest that he has played for at least a couple of years.  He may/may not yet be back to his absolute top best but he too had been written off by many and I thought he had disintegrated too far, mentally. Wrong.

Roger on the other hand - well, that was what made this match great.  Regardless of the ebbs and flows in his level, Roger displayed all his best qualities all at once in this match - elements were as he was in his prime, other elements were showing how he has attained a new peak to his own game - at 35.     His supreme tennis abilities as well as the inner strengths of his Champion personality were on full display and we all know that they haven't come together quite like that in a long while.  It was nothing short of magnificent and given the circumstances, well
I don't know whether it was or wasn't his finest match ever, but it sure felt like it.

Nothing new about Flink's bias, he has always tried to downplay Roger's achievements... I can bet you if Nadal had won the final he would rank it up there with the Wimby 08 final

^^^
I am coming to think if it is not a ESPN decision to downplay Roger and his achievements. The comms of ESPN Brasil do the same: all Nadal, all Djoker, even Murray, but Roger???? They had all the words to praise Nadal when he won the 4th set, NOT A SINGLE WORD ABOUT HOW ROGER BOUNCED BACK at the 5th. The warriors are always Nadal, or the Djoker. They fight back.

Disgusting.

tvradke wrote:Not a fan of Flink at all. When Roger was doing well in the summer of 2014, Flink dismissed Roger's wins as coming against sub-standard opposition or out of form players. He has also peddled the weak era garbage. Jon Wertheim used to get a lot of hate on the old website because of a couple of his comments against Roger over the years (The Wimbledon 2010 comment was excessively harsh) but in general, Wertheim is very complimentary of Roger and recognizes his genius. In all the years of watching Tennis channel and ESPN, I have never heard one educational insightful piece of information from Flink. So I honestly cannot put any stock in his assessment. Even if I agree with Flink that AO2017 wasn't the greatest match ever played even between these two, it is ridiculous to put the AO2012 ahead of this match. Quantity over Quality basically.

I have to say I disagree about Werthless 8) He blocks anyone on Twitter who dares argue with him (me for one but I have an alternate account where I can read his B.S.). The guy has  a pretty thin skin when it comes to criticism and believe me he has said some pretty crappy things about Roger. Not only the "low rent" comment. I wish I could remember the comment he made after Roger said Djokovic's winning return at the 2011 USO was "lucky". Wertheim implied that Roger was a sore loser but I can't remember his exact words now. It was very harsh though. I think when Wertheim is on tv doing his thing he has to toe the line and not show his biases. Even after this AO win the only compliment he could pay Roger was that he "out-Nadaled Rafael Nadal". That sounds like it was more a compliment to the spaniard than to Roger. I don't like the guy. I guess I hold grudges.

cornnn92 wrote:Nothing new about Flink's bias, he has always tried to downplay Roger's achievements... I can bet you if Nadal had won the final he would rank it up there with the Wimby 08 final

I suppose Flink is the exact opposite of me. I for one would NEVER consider the Wimbledon 2008 final as one of the best matches ever. Not even close. For me, it is Wimbledon 2007. But of course, had Roger won also in 2008 it would be an entirely different story.

This year's AO final is very special and ranks right up there as the best ever, in my opinion. But of course I am a fan and entitled to be biased.

RogerNo.1 wrote:

tvradke wrote:Not a fan of Flink at all. When Roger was doing well in the summer of 2014, Flink dismissed Roger's wins as coming against sub-standard opposition or out of form players. He has also peddled the weak era garbage. Jon Wertheim used to get a lot of hate on the old website because of a couple of his comments against Roger over the years (The Wimbledon 2010 comment was excessively harsh) but in general, Wertheim is very complimentary of Roger and recognizes his genius. In all the years of watching Tennis channel and ESPN, I have never heard one educational insightful piece of information from Flink. So I honestly cannot put any stock in his assessment. Even if I agree with Flink that AO2017 wasn't the greatest match ever played even between these two, it is ridiculous to put the AO2012 ahead of this match. Quantity over Quality basically.

I have to say I disagree about Werthless 8) He blocks anyone on Twitter who dares argue with him (me for one but I have an alternate account where I can read his B.S.). The guy has  a pretty thin skin when it comes to criticism and believe me he has said some pretty crappy things about Roger. Not only the "low rent" comment. I wish I could remember the comment he made after Roger said Djokovic's winning return at the 2011 USO was "lucky". Wertheim implied that Roger was a sore loser but I can't remember his exact words now. It was very harsh though. I think when Wertheim is on tv doing his thing he has to toe the line and not show his biases. Even after this AO win the only compliment he could pay Roger was that he "out-Nadaled Rafael Nadal". That sounds like it was more a compliment to the spaniard than to Roger. I don't like the guy. I guess I hold grudges.

tvradke:  Fully enjoyed your piece on Flink.  You don't often take folks to task so when I come across such posts I must admit to the guilty pleasure of reading them.

RogerNo.1:  Wertheim is a nerdy guy and can go off topic with some of the silliest stuff.  I suspect the fact that he's not a competitive athlete (does he play any sport - let alone at a high level - at all?) leaves him less sure of his place in the sports journo world.  When he sits on the TTC couch with Jim Courier and Paul Annacone, he strikes me as a little boy trying to find equal footing with the grown ups present.  Not surprising that he cuts off those who dare challenge him.  Good sleuthing on your part with an alternate twitter ID.

Still as much as Wertheim drives me nuts I give him credit for a wonderful piece he wrote about Stefan Edberg at the USO years back.  It was the last page of a Sports Illustrated issue.  Wertheim was picking up towels in the mens locker room and engaged in a conversation with Edberg.  When Edberg left, he also left a gift behind for Wertheim.  I wonder if Roger had gifted Wertheim with some kind of acknowledgement, thus elevating his place in the sports journo world in Wertheim's mind, would Wertheim have been more fair.  Obviously it doesn't matter since Roger lets his racket to the talking.

I would be remiss not to mention that Wertheim's book about the Wimbledon 2008 final was exceptional.  Like many here I was deeply upset by Roger's loss.  And, Wertheim's perspective and story telling helped make that loss less painful for this fan. It was well written.

Cheers,
wcr

Avasbar- I wasn't hot and bothered by you- it was the article! For me this is the match that will live forever- this is the tournament that will live forever. W2008- yes, with a different outcome- sure I would have loved it. As I would some of the finals he played with Djokovic. I too thought Wertheim's book interesting; it also gave me some insight into Nadal's head and tactics which I appreciated.
Whatever happens next the AO final will remain forever as the way tennis should be played-but, perhaps, can only be played by a genius.

oldfan wrote:

cornnn92 wrote:Nothing new about Flink's bias, he has always tried to downplay Roger's achievements... I can bet you if Nadal had won the final he would rank it up there with the Wimby 08 final

I suppose Flink is the exact opposite of me. I for one would NEVER consider the Wimbledon 2008 final as one of the best matches ever. Not even close. For me, it is Wimbledon 2007. But of course, had Roger won also in 2008 it would be an entirely different story.

This year's AO final is very special and ranks right up there as the best ever, in my opinion. But of course I am a fan and entitled to be biased.

Dear Biased Oldfan,

For my money I liked the Wimbledon 2009 final more.  I think it was even longer!  I found it more nerve racking given how well Roddick was playing.

Cheers,
wcr

Thanks for your insight on Wertheim wcr. I never read his account of the 2008 W final, probably because I would rather forget the whole thing. But I guess Roger finally got his revenge (although he isn't a vengeful guy, I am a vengeful girl ).

wcr wrote:

oldfan wrote:

cornnn92 wrote:Nothing new about Flink's bias, he has always tried to downplay Roger's achievements... I can bet you if Nadal had won the final he would rank it up there with the Wimby 08 final

I suppose Flink is the exact opposite of me. I for one would NEVER consider the Wimbledon 2008 final as one of the best matches ever. Not even close. For me, it is Wimbledon 2007. But of course, had Roger won also in 2008 it would be an entirely different story.

This year's AO final is very special and ranks right up there as the best ever, in my opinion. But of course I am a fan and entitled to be biased.

Dear Biased Oldfan,

For my money I liked the Wimbledon 2009 final more.  I think it was even longer!  I found it more nerve racking given how well Roddick was playing.

Cheers,
wcr

Dear wcr, I would never want to disagree with you. Wimbledon 2009 final had it all, including the added attraction of being Roger's 15th GS, breaking Pete Sampras' record. But the thing is, I couldn't help but feel sorry for Andy Roddick, getting so close yet ending up losing. The way he played he would also have been a worthy champion, but Roger (almost) always got the better of Andy. It is for that reason that I enjoyed their rivalry a lot more than the Roger/Rafa one. On the other hand, for me there is nothing sweeter than Roger winning a GS final against Nadal.

100% agree with you, oldfan. It was a bittersweet victory for Andy's loss. I remember how hard Andy worked with Stepanek to get back to his best form. He could have won so much more in tennis were it not for Roger and he always took his losses like a man.

Still, I must admit I enjoy Roger playing just about anyone other than Nadal for the brutal destruction value to RN's game. Roger's win at the AO this year was icing on the cake.

^^^
It is a real pleasure to come here and read your conversation. Thanks to you all, wcr, Biased Oldfan*, RogerNo1, Corinne, travdke.

*Biased could be a common nickname to all of us.

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